Thread Rating:
  • 5 Vote(s) - 5 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
80 years ago: Lest We Forget
#1
80 years ago this summer, it seemed a sure bet that Hitler and his gang would win the war in Europe.

By the end of summer of 1940, the issue was no longer so clear.

The pilots of the Royal Air Force had successfully defended Great Britain from German attacks.

In hindsight, it is easy to think it was all inevitable. 

Except it wasn't.  British resolve and courage in that summer changed the course of world history.

All glory to the Royal Air Force, and, thanks to the United Kingdom.

[Image: 240px-RAF-roundel-svg.png]

Cheers!
[Image: 14sigsepia.jpg]

Location: The lost world, Elsewhen
Reply
#2
(08-06-2020, 04:28 PM)F2d5thCav Wrote: 80 years ago this summer, it seemed a sure bet that Hitler and his gang would win the war in Europe.

By the end of summer of 1940, the issue was no longer so clear.

The pilots of the Royal Air Force had successfully defended Great Britain from German attacks.

In hindsight, it is easy to think it was all inevitable. 

Except it wasn't.  British resolve and courage in that summer changed the course of world history.

All glory to the Royal Air Force, and, thanks to the United Kingdom.

[Image: 240px-RAF-roundel-svg.png]

Cheers!

And cheers back to you 5th.  My Father was RAAF during the Darwin years as an armourer and my Uncle went over to England and flew Lancasters.

Nice to remember them.

Bally:)
Reply
#3
Greetings @Bally002 . . . and sincere thanks for the service of your family members.  Evil was manifest then and they fought the good fight.

Cheers!
[Image: 14sigsepia.jpg]

Location: The lost world, Elsewhen
Reply
#4
Explanation: Indeed!












Quote:The Ode

The Ode comes from For the Fallen, a poem by the English poet and writer Laurence Binyon and was published in London in the Winnowing Fan; Poems of the Great War in 1914. The verse, which became the League Ode, was already used in association with commemoration services in Australia in 1921.
"They shall grow not old, as we that are left grow old; 
Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemn. 
At the going down of the sun and in the morning 
We will remember them."

Each year after Anzac Day and Remembrance Day debate rises on the word 'condemn' or 'contemn'. The Ode used is the fourth stanza of the poem For the Fallen by Laurence Binyon and was written in the early days of World War One. By mid September 1914, less than seven weeks after the outbreak of war, the British Expeditionary Force in France had already suffered severe casualties. Long lists of the dead and wounded appeared in British newspapers. It was against this background that Binyon wrote For the Fallen. The poem was first published in The Times on 21 September 1914 using the word 'condemn'. Some people have suggested that the use of 'condemn' in The Times was a typographical error. However, The Winnowing Fan, published a month or two later and for which Binyon would have had galley proofs on which to mark amendments, 'condemn' was again used.
The British Society of Authors, executors of the Binyon estate, says the word is definitely 'condemn', while the British Museum, where Binyon worked, says its memorial stone also shows 'condemn'. Both expressed surprise when told there had been some debate about the matter in Australia. The condemn/contemn issue seems to be a distinctly Australian phenomenon. Inquiries with the British, Canadian and American Legions revealed that none had heard of the debate.
'Contemn' is not used in Binyon's published anthologies and the two volumes set, Collected Poems, regarded as the definitive version of Binyon's poems, uses 'condemn'. The Returned and Services League handbook shows 'condemn' and a representative of the Australian War Memorial said it always used 'condemn' in its ceremonies.

https://www.army.gov.au/our-heritage/traditions/ode






Personal Disclosure:











minusculebeercheers
Reply
#5
Cheers!   minusculebeercheers
Reply
#6
(08-06-2020, 04:28 PM)F2d5thCav Wrote: 80 years ago this summer, it seemed a sure bet that Hitler and his gang would win the war in Europe.

By the end of summer of 1940, the issue was no longer so clear.

The pilots of the Royal Air Force had successfully defended Great Britain from German attacks.

minusculeclap

They've all gotta be at the hundred year mark, or ...

Can you imagine being attacked, on your island, constantly, by the Luftwaffe?

Can you imagine being on the high seas and running into the U-boats of the Kriegsmarine during the Battle of the Atlantic?

Our British cousins may have sticks up their butts, but they sure do stiffen the spine!!

minusculebeercheers
'Cause if they catch you in the backseat tryin'ta pick her locks
They're gonna send you home to momma in a cardboard box
You better run!!
Reply
#7
My husband father was in WWII in the Navy. Joined the day after Pearl Harbor.
My husband says, Thank You To Britain for being there to fight.

[Image: EVVX80jWsAcB6rY.jpg][Image: NHSPoster_1024x1024.jpg?v=1591880058]

[Image: ve-day-1-768x1131.jpg] Of Course America too.
[Image: 8-mai-2018-730x730.jpg]
Once A Rogue, Always A Rogue!
[Image: attachment.php?aid=936]
Reply
#8
Had another anniversary slip by yesterday.  81 years since the Germans stormed into Poland and ignited the Second World War in Europe.

Brutal times.

I remember my father telling me how awe-inspiring it was, as a GI in France in 1945, to see the thousand-plane bomber formations of the Allies pass overhead ("it went on and on").

Cheers
[Image: 14sigsepia.jpg]

Location: The lost world, Elsewhen
Reply
#9
Truly brave souls. Calling all of them the Greatest Generation seems to almost belie their incredible character. They gave all. Thank goodness we had Churchill and Roosevelt and all those brave Tommy's and GIs. ( :
internet Agent Provocateur
Reply
#10
Just figured out your handle , forward 2nd division 5th cavalry.
The Truth is Out There, Somewhere
Reply
#11
Close, bro.

Company F
2nd Battalion
5th Cavalry Regiment

tinybiggrin 

Cheers
[Image: 14sigsepia.jpg]

Location: The lost world, Elsewhen
Reply
#12
My dad was aboard a ship in the gulf of mexico for the Navy during the Cuba missile crisis. He had no clue what was going on and he was a radio man.
The Truth is Out There, Somewhere
Reply
#13
Yep, my sincere thanks and gratitude to everyone who helped to destroy the nazis. And to those younger ones here, who had family members involved in doing that. You can now tap yourself on the shoulder a couple of times and say to yourself: "i have some butt-kicker, winner genes within me"

And I KNOW! I have heard it ALL! Yeah i am Finnish. Yeah Finland mingled with the nazis. Come on, i am 38 years old so i wash my hands from that shame completely.
[Image: attachment.php?aid=8023]
Reply
#14
(09-02-2020, 11:07 AM)Finspiracy Wrote: Yep, my sincere thanks and gratitude to everyone who helped to destroy the nazis. And to those younger ones here, who had family members involved in doing that. You can now tap yourself on the shoulder a couple of times and say to yourself: "i have some butt-kicker, winner genes within me"

And I KNOW! I have heard it ALL! Yeah i am Finnish. Yeah Finland mingled with the nazis. Come on, i am 38 years old so i wash my hands from that shame completely.

Finn study your history before you make comments like that about our home land.
WAR IS PEACE, FREEDOM IS SLAVERY, IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH, THE EU IS FATHER AND MOTHER
Reply
#15
Dad was in Patton's army and partook of the battle of the Bulge. At that time he was a machine gunner. He ended up the last guy alive in his squad twice according to some of his war buddies. Dad was and is a good guy but I will be surprised if he makes it another year. He is 93. Did the war affect him.. I am sure it did in many ways but he never really talked about it ...
He did once say that the German soldiers were treated humanely but they shot the SS guys on sight for in the GI's eyes they were nonredeemable.

I think because of the war he made damn sure I could shoot and hunt at a very early age as we lived on a farm. I would not trade my childhood for anything even though at times dad had the fastest belt in Texas ! hahah

A dog, a horse, plenty of land to explore and hunt on. Closest neighbors about a mile away, both girls a few years older than me.. We had some great times as they also had horses and liked me!! hahaha.

I am sure I would have volunteered to fly for the RAF or I would have gone to China and flown for the Flying Tigers if I would have lived back then and been in a position to accomplish either one .. I am not complaining as many a good man/woman was killed doing what they thought was "RIGHT" so we all stand on the shoulders of those who went before us...
Reply
#16
(09-03-2020, 10:50 AM)Wallfire Wrote:
(09-02-2020, 11:07 AM)Finspiracy Wrote: Yep, my sincere thanks and gratitude to everyone who helped to destroy the nazis. And to those younger ones here, who had family members involved in doing that. You can now tap yourself on the shoulder a couple of times and say to yourself: "i have some butt-kicker, winner genes within me"

And I KNOW! I have heard it ALL! Yeah i am Finnish. Yeah Finland mingled with the nazis. Come on, i am 38 years old so i wash my hands from that shame completely.

Finn study your history before you make comments like that about our home land.

Wikipedia: During the Continuation War (1941–1944) Finland was co-belligerent and a tactical ally of Nazi Germany against the Soviet Union, and dependent on food, fuel and armament shipments from Germany.

Also Wikipedia: Finland participated in the Second World War initially as an independent country battling the Soviet Union, followed by another battle with the Soviet Union as a co-belligerent with Nazi Germany and then finally switching sides to the Allies against Nazi Germany. As relations with the Soviet Union changed during the war, Finland was placed in the unusual situation of being for, then against and then for the overall interests of the Allied powers

What did i miss @Wallfire? Sincere question. History is a weak area for me. It was boring during my school years and i saw no point in learning about things that have already been and now gone. I have been trying to catch up now as an adult, but there are gaps. Can you help me fix this area? Finland, nazis and world war 2?
[Image: attachment.php?aid=8023]
Reply
#17
@Finspiracy 

I'll give a comment from (one) USA perspective.

Finland was forced into the war by the Soviet Union in 1939.  Yes, that first war concluded, but with significant loss of Finnish territory.

The Continuation War, IMO, was Finland seeing a chance to recover the lost territory.  Note the Finns never tried to advance on Leningrad, much to the consternation of Berlin.  Of course, given the outcome of World War II, this part of Finland's fight was going to be lost no matter how well the Finns fought.

As to the question of guilt.  Most of the questions of guilt in World War II orbit two topics: 1) Aggression against other nations, and 2) crimes against humanity.

I don't think #1 is applicable to Finland.  Yes, they attacked in 1941, but only because the Soviets had already taken land from them in a war 18 months prior to Germany's invasion of the Soviet Union.

You guys from Finland have to answer #2.  My understanding is that Finland did not round up Jews or other people and hand them over to the Germans.  But I may be wrong about that or there may important nuances of which I am not aware.

In conclusion, the alliance with Nazi Germany seems to have been a vehicle of convenience for Finland to regain lost territory.  Yeah, there were Finns in the Waffen-SS.  A bunch of European nations had people who joined the SS -- not, IMO, representative of the mentality of the nations involved.  So certainly not something that was unique to Finland.

Cheers
[Image: 14sigsepia.jpg]

Location: The lost world, Elsewhen
Reply
#18
(09-04-2020, 04:08 PM)F2d5thCav Wrote: @Finspiracy 

I'll give a comment from (one) USA perspective.

Finland was forced into the war by the Soviet Union in 1939.  Yes, that first war concluded, but with significant loss of Finnish territory.

The Continuation War, IMO, was Finland seeing a chance to recover the lost territory.  Note the Finns never tried to advance on Leningrad, much to the consternation of Berlin.  Of course, given the outcome of World War II, this part of Finland's fight was going to be lost no matter how well the Finns fought.

As to the question of guilt.  Most of the questions of guilt in World War II orbit two topics: 1) Aggression against other nations, and 2) crimes against humanity.

I don't think #1 is applicable to Finland.  Yes, they attacked in 1941, but only because the Soviets had already taken land from them in a war 18 months prior to Germany's invasion of the Soviet Union.

You guys from Finland have to answer #2.  My understanding is that Finland did not round up Jews or other people and hand them over to the Germans.  But I may be wrong about that or there may important nuances of which I am not aware.

In conclusion, the alliance with Nazi Germany seems to have been a vehicle of convenience for Finland to regain lost territory.  Yeah, there were Finns in the Waffen-SS.  A bunch of European nations had people who joined the SS -- not, IMO, representative of the mentality of the nations involved.  So certainly not something that was unique to Finland.

Cheers

Yep Finland refused to take part in the siege of Leningrad and in doing so saved Leningrad and in saving the city save the world from Hitler, because if Leningrad had fallen the USSR would of fallen. Stalin remembered this and thats why he never took Finland after the war. Finland drove Germany out of the country as agreed with the USSR and the Germans did horrible thing to Lapland and its people. As far as the Jewish question , yes some were given to the Germans but most of them were protected or helped to get to Sweden.
I remember back in the 80s I was with my Sami girlfriend in the back of nowhere in Lapland, we were talking English as she like to do so when two large Sami men asked if I was German, I said no im Finnish but because I have spent time in England my accent is a bit strange, my Sami friend confirmed this and the men smiled and left. I ask her what was that all about, she answered  if you had of been German they would of cut my balls off. I was about to laugh then I saw her face, she was not joking.
WAR IS PEACE, FREEDOM IS SLAVERY, IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH, THE EU IS FATHER AND MOTHER
Reply


Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)